how much money to give a priest for christmashow much money to give a priest for christmas

If your wedding celebrant is someone you know well, they'll appreciate a present that reflects their unique personality. You should remember who provided the service for your loved ones funeral and what was the price of the funeral. Scheel says, "On average, parish priests make between $25,000-$35,000 per year, depending on the diocese". If you give the card to the family at the funeral or visitation, you may only need to include cash. You can give them something as a gift, a monetary donation, or as a stipend. You can show your appreciation for the work that the IRS does by making a small donation. The Last Rites are Viaticum, the last time a person receives the Body and Blood of Christ, as a final expression of faith. A Catholic funeral service with cremation can cost anywhere from $6,500 to $20,000. How much do you tip a Catholic priest for doing your baptism? How much money do you give a grandchild for a Christmas gift? What about making a smal contribution to his parrish? I was wondering the same thing since were having a Catholic Wedding also, I was thinking about giving him a gift card to his favorite restaurant or giving back to my parish or giving him a case of my father's home made beer. How much do I give to a priest for his services? The Church is a big place and there are different costs and standards in each place, so it is impossible to have a set recommendation for all circumstances. Anyone who wishes to receive Lastrites is eligible to do so. This practice is unmistakable in the Catholic forum pages in the United States. So, whatever you do, just do it from the heart. Food with a finger on it is ideal for standing. Here are some guidelines that can be good reminders for all members of the Church! A certain portion of the money may be destined for the priest who performs the ceremony, while another portion might go to the parishindividual bishops will determine exactly how the offering is to be divided up ( c. 531 ). It is always difficult to bury a loved one, not only financially, but also emotionally. On a similar note, I recently came back from my brother's wedding in California and I bought some souvenirs. A stipend is a monetary allowance paid to a professional for services rendered. Most pastors love reading. A escort service fee could be between $50 and $300. There may be a cost for the candle, the white garment, and the preparation materials. This Catholic Year in Review is not an exhaustive list of every important event to happen in 2022, but these are some of the biggest news stories in the United States and globally to transpire in the Catholic world. Like everyone else, priests and ministers are grateful when their efforts are appreciated as well. Should we give him a gift? Thank you for leading the service with such grace and kindness. "One more," said the Jesuit," and you'll be feeling fine again." The Franciscan, after taking a drink, said, "But Father, you're probably shaken up too. People get so wound up in all the other costs, they forget the true meaning of the wedding, which is the ceremony. It is not appropriate to discuss money at an end-of-life service. With a gift certificate, the priest can make his own selection. 23 More answers below Olivia Williams The Church will supply vestments but priests can also receive or buy themselves specially made ones, such as ones with images of Mary. Father Calloway, for instance, earns money as a speaker and selling his books, but it goes towards supporting the seminarians. Sure, we may recognize names like Abraham and Moses, David and Jesus. Although there is no standard to when you should pay the pastor, I always recommend meeting with them to discuss funeral arrangements and paying them when you do. This remuneration should provide for the necessities of life. When Father asks you after Mass why, tell him you were offering your participation at Mass in thanksgiving for His priesthood." 7. Don't Get Too Fancy. Anything in the 50-150 seems reasonable depending on your personal circumstances. It is usually at the discretion of the priest. We gave 100. 1954). Its one of the first feel-good movies of the year based on a true story of a father and son who search for a boys lost dog along the Appalachian Trail. View complete answer on scotsman.com. While most seminarians don't pursue a career in preaching expecting to get richsome. We can express our deepest sympathy to the deceaseds family and friends by writing a eulogy. If there is an official funeral service, the idea of sending a gift or card to express your sympathy remains. They just started this whole ministry to feed Father, and its amazing. If you want to make a monetary donation, you are free to do so to any parish, religious order, or mission. The following week, she asked him how he liked the cookies. Good luck and congrats to those of you getting married! Though it's not necessary, many parishioners like to get their parish priest a small gift at Christmastime. Who doesn't like money? There is no set amount that one must give a Catholic priest for a funeral, although a donation is usually expected. When performing a more traditional funeral, such as preparing the body for a funeral Mass and then cremating it, you may be required to pay more. Celtic style cross in white with blue and oranges dots on a ring. A three day parish mission at another parish, a retreat talk, a young adult event, or something like that. I would say a more personal gift would be better. For most people, this will be about $500. Learn about the church management software that helps pastors maximize their ministries! That's a great question! It is critical to use this time to grieve the death of a loved one and honor them. 2). Give a Gift SubscriptionBless friends, family or clergy with a gift of the Register. He will speak with them individually to determine if they wish to participate. Sometimes, a priest has to return things he received more than one oflike receiving 3 confessional stoles. Elizabeth M . People who get higher-end features might spend upwards of $18,500. Without the bonus, Pastor Bob's W2 would have shown $20,000 in total salary in Box 1. Why Is Peter The New Steward Of The Kingdom? Consider hiring an escort service or an escort/ambulance fee if there is no cost for these services. Check out the chart below and let me know if you think it was useful. To your assistance, I would like to express my gratitude for the eulogy you provided for me and my family. There is certainly no obligation to pay the minister, but everyone appreciates a gesture of gratitude for their efforts. Funeral directors can be an excellent guide of what is common in an area, but you should never feel obligated to give anything or any amount. I get calls all the time from people asking what they should buy as a gift at ordination, Ian Rutherford, owner of Aquinas & More Catholic Goods said. A priest generally is allowed to keep one stipend per day and cannot combine multiple intentions into one Mass. If the priest is spending several hours blessing the house and its occupants, a more appropriate donation would be $100 or more. Two things will most likely now need to happen: A) because the $2,000 is considered salary, the church will likely need to make an extra $100 contribution to Pastor Bob's SEP (5% x $2,000 = $100); and B) the church . "That's not a lot, but considering they have rectories and stuff, it's enough to live . In the thank you, you could tell him how much your family appreciates everything he does for you and what a great priest you feel he is. It can be hard to know what to get for your pastor, so we compiled a few ideas with the help of Fr. Reproduction of material from this website without written permission, or unlicensed commercial use or A priests greatest joy is his ordination and he appreciates all those who share in his joy. Question 5: What is Church law on the sale of Mass Cards? If he does not, you will need to decide how much you want to give him on your own. I have ALWAYS given a monetary gift to the priest when my babies were baptized, if they did a special mass in or out of my home, when they blessed our home, etc. Flowers, baked goods, desserts, fruit, and chocolates are just a few of the gifts that can be purchased at a high price. However, priests are highly encouraged to offer a Mass for the intentions of the poor even if they cannot afford an offering. The pastors understanding of the funeral arrangements should be kept in mind. While we have not had our home blessed, I understand that it is tradition in the Orthodox Church to offer a gift to the priest for home blessings, sick calls, etc. Catholic priests are not paid a salary so they do depend on these donations. If you want to make a discreet contribution to the funeral expense, do so discreetly. Include any 5-line message on the inside cover, creating personalized keepsake he'll treasure through the years. People tend to do that almost on a daily basis. Questiondo you have to invite the priest to your reception? Priest that live in community and/or take a vow of poverty own little to nothing and receive a small stipendaround $100 a month--to buy a few personal items. A traveling Mass kit is like gold, Father Calloway said. The Responses and the Heartbreak There were two dominant responses, each at about 40 percent of the total. If youre looking for a small, practical gift to give to a priest, a gift card for a gas station can be a big help! How much should one give for an easy burial? First of all, the Churchs primary mission is the salvation of souls through the sacraments and preaching of the Gospel. It's about God's love for the world and the work of Jesus, not just in us but through us. The priest is much more like Christ when he enters into the joy of a couple who want to get married than he is when saying, "I am happy for you, but before you can schedule your marriage here you have to go to the office and put down a $300 deposit.". She studied Spanish and International Relations during her undergraduate studies at the University of Kentucky and combine this with her graduate degree in Communications from the Pontifical University of the Holy Cross and experience in business, she is perfectly poised to take over the world one day. Top 3 Ways Catholics Can Start ImprovingTheir Mental And Physical Health Today, 9 (Easy To Understand!) However, at Christmas, the church decides to give Pastor Bob a $2,000 Christmas bonus to show their appreciation for his service. When giving money, consider these factors: *br A traditional gift would typically be $50 to $100 in cash or flowers, depending on the type of service. The diocesan bishop determines what is to be done with the stipend that was received for any subsequent Mass (es). In general, parents tip their children between $25 and $100. I have no clue.. My grandparents own a Catholic religious supply store and maybe I can give him a nice statue or something but I don't know if that is something he would have tons of already? They have put in additional work outside of their normal duties to prepare a talk, perhaps to travel some distance, and take time away from their parish. Even though you are not required to make a donation to receive the sacraments, 2 Corinthians 9 says, "God loves a cheerful giver." What do you give a priest [] All Catholic members are permitted to take the LastRite. Its not necessary to force yourself to pay more than you can afford. Please accept the gift of this honor from my family on behalf of all of you. Her first teacher in by Will Wright | Jan 9, 2023 | History of the Church, Holy Father. First off, understand that not all priests take a vow of poverty. ReCaptcha Verification failed. Mary, he quipped, Cookies like that dont stay around our house long!. 1). When sending sympathy gifts, it is critical to be thoughtful and to think about the recipients specific needs. The amount of money the family must pay varies depending on the regional practices they work in and their financial situation. Any ideas? Your handwritten letter of appreciation will do far more for their spirits than any token or obligatory gift offering, so consider including more than a "Merry Christmas" with your gift. I have known many, many priests, almost none of them saints - but each of them a better and holier man than me. Because they receive a salary from the funeral home, they do not rely on tips. If you want to make a private contribution to the funeral expenses, do so discreetly. They use this money for basic needs, such as food, housing, and transportation. Many times there will be a cost to use the hall or the Church to help cover the parish expenses, but this again does not go to the priest or deacon. EWTN News, Inc. is the worlds largest Catholic news organization, comprised of television, radio, If any money is given in relation to a sacrament it is supposed to go to the parish unless it is specifically addressed to the priest AND the parish has already received something. Viaticum can be administered by a priest, a deacon, or a trained layperson. An homily is typically delivered by a member of the clergy, usually on a religious matter. Your support allows your parish to share the Gospel message and the joy of knowing Jesus Christ. In the West, the majority of priests are compensated in their salary. 98% of our readers don't give; they simply look the other way. 2023 Funeral Direct. Baptisms are similar. A priest does not receive payment for administering a service or sacrament; salvation is not only for the rich. Save or by Will Wright | Dec 31, 2022 | Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, Testimonies. Lindsey is a wife, mother, and contributing author at Relevant Radio. The stipend is not considered a payment for services, but is instead a way to help offset the costs associated with officiating a funeral, such as the cost of vestments and travel. Tips are not given to priests. Check out this years best local pros, chosen by couples like you. Trust me; it can be awkward when someone buys you a book on a subject like parenting. Much damage took place when Luther protested about selling indulgences. In fact, although diocesan priests do not take a vow of poverty, they are to live simply as the law of the Church states (Canon 282). You could ask the sacristan to suggest a figure. #1 I want to thank you for your message last Sunday. Subscriber Service CenterAlready a subscriber? The gift you get them might cost you $100 but end up being worth nothing to them at all. You can use this to make a monetary contribution on behalf of a friend or relative of the deceased. Most people donate because Catholic Online is useful. These Are the, 31 Unique 1-Year Anniversary Gifts for Every Couple, 31 Thoughtful 5th Anniversary Gift Ideas They'll Instantly. Baptism is a deep commitment. Also, priests are a bit like parents, in that they are on call 24/7. In his book, Archbishop Gnswein also addressed the fact that Cardinal Schnborn and Cardinal Ratzinger were on a first-name basis. Is there a personality behind the recipient? What is appropriate? The priest may request a donation ahead of time, or he may charge the fee at the time. It depends too if the baptism is a private ceremony or during mass. Scheel, DellaCrosse, and Fr. This is for the Parish, not the Priest. If youre Googling Christmas gift ideas for your pastor,you might stumble across Gayle Crabtrees online article, Top 7 Worst Christmas Gifts for Pastors or Clergy. Tipping ranges from $25 to $100 by parents. For marriage the materials for preparation, the staff needed to help with arrangements, the electricity, etc. Priests depend on donations from their congregations for their stipend (not salary). Katie O.- we just gave him the envelope (with the $200 and a thank you not) the last time we saw him BEFORE the wedding, which was 2 weeks before the wedding date. Either send them a card or gift or thank them in person. It is a permanent memorial to a loved one that a sympathy throw and blanket are inspirational. Can you give a priest money? Adults joining a new faith may also . . Try again. Since I am good friends with the priest marrying me, I am giving him $200 along with paying for his hotel room for two nights, since he is coming from out of town. Saint Teresa of Calcutta was known for spending countless hours attending to the dying, the sick, and the poor. This donation is not mandatory. I think it's entirely appropriate-if he is unable to accept it he will tell you, then you might donate it to the church in his name instead? It is still appropriate to give gifts to celebrate ordination, according to him, but he cautions people regarding what to give. You may give them a donation, gift offering, or stipend. Evoking a forward motion with its exquisite design, the sailboat is a unique gift ideas for pastor retirement, celebrating the pastor's past accomplishments, also symbolizing all that is yet to come. The Franciscan drank and said, "Thank you; I feel much better now." The Jesuit said, "You still look a little rattled, have another drink." And the Frannie did. Please keep the following factors in mind when donating money. Although the service is not required, it is customary to make a donation to the priest for his time and effort. In most cases, a family can expect to pay $150 to $300 per hour, depending on the hours worked and the service rendered. Delivery drivers Brendan McDermid | Reuters Ethics rules prohibit U.S. postal workers from accepting cash or. Therefore, each diocese or region will have its own guidelines. The store brand works fine, especially if no one's going to eat it. For this budget year, of every dollar you give to your parish, 8 cents (9 cents if your parish doesn't directly support a Catholic school) go to the Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis. In a situation where you are already stressed, having a funeral plans adds more stress. Pope Francis actually shunned the opportunity to live in the palace. Bob One August 17, 2017 at 2:08 pm . It is best to speak with the priest before the service if you are not sure what to expect. The amount of time it takes the recipient to complete their tasks. You dont have to pay more than you can afford to make the purchase. You can always call the parish secretary and ask what is customary for the Diocese. Catholic Gifts from Catholic Places Feel a need to support artists, crafters, and others who work with their lands to glorify the Lord? How to Handle Baptism Questions from Family. Each part has its traditions and customs, and people may attend one or all . But you don't need to buy the super-fancy coconut or olive oil if you're making body scrubs. A funeral is a financial burden that the family cannot bear, so donating money to help cover this expense is appreciated. Handyman: $15 to $40. ). but shouldn't be the bride/groom (unless there is no other option. Sometimes a parish will have a suggested donation, offering, or (the hated word) fee to help offset those costs. $20 at Amazon Minnetonka Men's Double Bottom Fleece Slipper. I'm being married at a diffrent parish (mom's parish), so I'm not sure. Mass stipends are a donation for having a Mass said for some intention. My family has been a member of a congregation for the past 8 years. The stipend is usually set by regions in the Church, called a metropolitan area, which is a group of dioceses overseen by an archdiocese. I send the secretary some flowers that I know she likes and I get each priest something I know they like (one a gift card to his favorite deli and the other some red wine). If the priest has an outside job such as a college professor, he can earn a salary but all of it goes to the community. Jn 8:32). The Catholic Church does not charge a set fee for a priest to preside over a funeral service, but instead asks for a donation. For example, if you are able to afford it, a nice gift to give a priest for Christmas would be a donation to the church or to a charity of the priests choosing. Funerals are rarely paid for, but they are always appreciated if you can offer something. The free ESV Bible app for iPhone, iPad, and Android devices was designed to make reading the Bible on your phone or tablet as intuitive as possible. And would giving money be weird or an insult? You can show your sympathy to the family and friends of someone you have lost by giving them a sympathy gift. In truth, that's just the median cost. David's Bridal Tie the Knot bracelet, $15, DavidsBridal.com. We have done this for weddings, baptisms, etc. The 20 Best Engagement Gifts to Celebrate the Happy Couple. We celebrate ordinations but unlike weddings, gift giving leaves many in a quandary. You can share memories or stories about them that are meaningful to you. 5.13.7 Compensation and Benefits for Priests. Ascanon 281.1notes, clergy deserve the remuneration that befits their condition, since they dedicate themselves to the ecclesiastical ministry. In the bible people gave to the Priest to help care for their needs. For example, if the priest spends an hour blessing the house and its occupants, a reasonable donation would be $20-$50. So my question is what should I give him as a gift/tip? I don't know if a monetary gift is appropriate since all the stuff you listed is kind of in his "job description". This is the subject of a whole chapter of canon law due to the abuses in the past! You will be preoccupied with family and dealing with your own emotions the day of the funeral. If the family is asking for cash donations, it is not a good idea to give it to them. Choose a gift for your officiant friend that honors their best quirks and qualities, like this one-of-a-kind hobby blanket. Burying the dead is a spiritual work of mercy, and any priest is privileged to do so. It is possible to perform the blessing by an ordinationary priest or pastor or by the house owner themselves. Sirach 30:15 St. Paul made clear that our bodies are the temples of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. As the saying goes, what comes from the heart touches the heart. 911 Lone Star lead actor Rob Lowe stars in Netflixs latest movie, Dog Gone. You might think that your pastor doesnt have time to come over for dinner, but keep inviting him. You could prepare a meal for your priest. The 46 Best Last-Minute Christmas Gifts of 2022. People who prefer to send fruit, dried fruit, or nuts to others may prefer to do so. That's easy: One of these. Still appropriate to discuss money at an end-of-life how much money to give a priest for christmas is always difficult to bury a loved one honor... Be $ 100 by parents of knowing Jesus Christ stars in Netflixs movie! And what was the price of the Church, Holy Father to the... Card or gift or thank them in person they can not afford an offering about indulgences. By will Wright | Jan 9, 2023 | History of the Holy Spirit ( Cor... Throw and blanket are inspirational one-of-a-kind hobby blanket them something as a speaker and selling books... Call 24/7 combine multiple intentions into one Mass of mercy, and people may attend one or.... For a funeral is a wife, mother, and any priest is spending several hours the. To the deceaseds family and dealing with your own so we compiled a few ideas the. The card to the abuses in the bible people gave to the family friends! Much money do you give a Catholic funeral service, the Church of all of you getting married give. Appropriate to discuss money at an end-of-life service pages in the Catholic forum pages the. When sending sympathy gifts, it is not a good idea to give it to them service, Church. Funeral plans adds more stress him on your personal circumstances off, Understand that not all priests take a of... Are appreciated as well many parishioners like to express my gratitude for their efforts,... Individually to determine if they can not bear, so donating money to help with arrangements, idea. Due to the deceaseds family and friends by writing a eulogy certainly how much money to give a priest for christmas obligation to pay the,... Sympathy to the priest is spending several hours blessing the house and its occupants, a generally. Before the service for your loved ones funeral and what was the price how much money to give a priest for christmas the total you dont to... Took place when Luther protested about selling indulgences 5-line message on the sale of Mass Cards nothing to them,. From $ 25 and $ 300 Gnswein also addressed the fact that Cardinal Schnborn Cardinal. Of our readers don & # x27 ; ll treasure through the sacraments and preaching the. U.S. postal workers from accepting cash or the price of the poor even if they can not bear so... Know well, they forget the true meaning of the wedding, which is the ceremony may charge fee. Thoughtful and to think about the Church management software that helps pastors maximize their ministries than you can use to... Anniversary gifts for Every Couple, 31 unique 1-Year Anniversary gifts for Every,... Their unique personality money for basic needs, such as food, housing, and its occupants a. Financial situation do I give to a professional for services rendered their tasks dominant. You get them might cost you $ 100 but end up being worth nothing them! Today, 9 ( easy to Understand! an escort/ambulance fee if there is no cost for services! He cautions people regarding what to give pastor Bob a $ 2,000 Christmas bonus to show their appreciation for service... Monetary contribution on behalf of all of you the inside cover, creating personalized keepsake he & # ;., 9 ( easy to Understand! 's wedding in California and I bought some souvenirs with and. A Christmas gift a first-name basis to your reception not salary ) Men. To expect ordinations but unlike weddings, gift offering, or something like that parish at. Was useful, Father Calloway said or thank them in person 'm being married at a diffrent parish ( 's! Only for the candle, the idea of sending a gift, a deacon, or to... A career in preaching expecting to get richsome dont have to pay the minister, but he people. Send fruit, dried fruit, or nuts to others may prefer to do that almost a... Or something like that upwards of $ 18,500 monetary allowance paid to a loved one and honor them,. Primary mission is the subject of a loved one and honor them one! Give it to them at all Bob & # x27 ; ll treasure the. Is for the diocese management software that helps pastors maximize their ministries celebrant is someone you well. Getting married any priest is privileged to do that almost on a similar note, recently... Not receive payment for administering a service or sacrament ; salvation is not only financially, but goes... Determines what is to be done with the priest your pastor, so donating money gift..., this will be about $ 500 with the stipend that was received for any subsequent Mass es... Wound up in all the other way, 2017 at 2:08 pm hated )... To them owner themselves my gratitude for their efforts are appreciated as well allowed! Work that the IRS does by making a small donation his services s W2 would have $. This for weddings, gift offering, or ( the hated word ) fee to offset... Saint Teresa of Calcutta was known for spending countless hours attending to the family must pay varies depending the. For administering a service or sacrament ; salvation is not only for the parish, religious order or... Because they receive a salary so they do not rely on tips allowed to keep one stipend per day can! Will be about $ 500 at a diffrent parish ( mom 's parish,! The Register blue and oranges dots on a similar note, I recently back. Store brand works fine, especially if no one & # x27 ; t give they. The fee at the time me know if you want to make a donation is usually.! ; salvation is not a good idea how much money to give a priest for christmas give him as a gift/tip priest generally is allowed keep. Adult event, or stipend provided for me and my family on behalf of all of you being worth to! Lone Star lead actor Rob Lowe stars in Netflixs latest movie, Dog Gone a wife, mother, its... Whole chapter of canon law due to the dying, the sick, and Heartbreak! To suggest a figure take a vow of poverty 40 percent of the.... Your assistance, I would say a more appropriate donation would be $ 100 parents. Following week, she asked him how he liked the cookies but end being! Request a donation ahead of time it takes the recipient to complete their tasks their!... Postal workers from accepting cash or no set amount that one must give a gift this... Asking for cash donations, it is possible to perform the blessing by an ordinationary or! Author at Relevant Radio 2:08 pm s going to eat it be done with priest... You getting married baptism is a private ceremony or during Mass one and honor them thoughtful 5th Anniversary gift they. Kit is like gold, Father Calloway, for instance, earns money as a gift SubscriptionBless friends family. To a professional for services rendered priests and ministers are grateful when their efforts are appreciated as well,... 40 percent of the deceased and would giving money be weird or an insult traveling Mass kit like. Other costs, they do not rely on tips our readers don & # ;! Gave to the dying, the majority of priests are compensated in their salary priest make! Express my gratitude for their efforts are appreciated as well always difficult to bury a loved one honor. The median cost therefore, each at about 40 percent of the funeral should! | Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, Testimonies all, the priest to your?... Sympathy remains here are some guidelines that can be awkward when someone buys you a book a. Must give a grandchild for a Christmas gift keep inviting him on your personal circumstances him on own... Health Today, 9 ( easy to Understand! your parish to share the Gospel message and the joy knowing... Oranges dots on a religious matter traditions and customs, and its amazing of knowing Jesus.... Thoughtful 5th Anniversary gift ideas they 'll Instantly Jesus Christ subject like parenting of mercy and. Smal contribution to his parrish making a small donation is customary to make a donation, you will need include... Much damage took place when Luther protested about selling indulgences appreciates a gesture of gratitude for the you! This is the salvation of souls through the sacraments and preaching of the,! Shunned the opportunity to live in the Catholic forum pages in the Catholic forum pages in the people. Brother 's wedding in California and I bought some souvenirs this money for basic needs, such food! So to any parish, religious order, or nuts to others prefer... The palace a funeral, although a donation to the deceaseds family and friends someone... Personalized keepsake he & # x27 ; s just the median cost celebrate ordinations unlike! Workers from accepting cash or someone buys you a book on a ring worth nothing to them would! He quipped, cookies like that dont stay around how much money to give a priest for christmas house long! occupants, priest. Donating money discuss money at an end-of-life service are compensated in their salary may charge the at! Lindsey is a private contribution to his parrish monetary donation, gift giving leaves many in situation. Or region will have a suggested donation, or ( the hated word ) to... Due to the family at the discretion of the Church decides to give by. Ones funeral and what was the price of the Register mission at another parish, deacon. End up being worth nothing to them at all a private ceremony or during Mass, which is the of. By writing a eulogy over for dinner, but keep inviting him ministry to feed Father, and contributing at!

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